Our exclusive conversation with Don Norman, co-founder and principal emeritus at Nielsen Norman Group, is the author of The Design of Everyday Things. This interview is now #1 trending on Design YouTube (and ADPList meetups, below ⬇️).
21st Century Design, Controversy, AI, Hard Problems, and Legacy
Don Norman is an emeritus Distinguished Professor at the University of California, San Diego. He's a co-founder of the Nielsen Norman group and has held executive positions at Apple and HP. He has authored 21 books, including "Emotional Design" and "Design of Everyday Things," and his latest book is "Design for a Better World."
Evolution of designers and leaders since the 80s
Artificial Intelligence on humanity
Why there’s a lack of “designer” CEOs
Hardest problem to solve
Why Generalist will be important
How to work on important frontiers
21st Century Design and Ethics
Why Apple’s take on simplicity is wrong
Conflict of Don Norman’s past work
Advice to designers, humans
Some key takeaways:
Theory is far from reality—Design education needs to be more broadly based, focusing on design thinking skills rather than just drawing skills. Humanity-centered design considers the impact on all living things and the ecological system, not just individual users. STEM education lacks focus on people and history, which are crucial for understanding design and innovation.
Apple is wrong about simplicity—Good design isn't just about looks; it's about functionality and usability, especially when things go wrong. Simplicity is complex, not just removing icons or buttons.
Designers cannot just design—Designers must ensure their work not only addresses immediate economic needs but also contributes to long-term sustainability and societal well-being. Leadership requires more than just designing on Figma, it’s holistically viewing a problem.
Watch this full exclusive interview here.
Where to find Don Norman:
Don Norman's LinkedIn
Don Norman Design Award: https://dnda.design
Don Norman’s new book: Design for a Better World:
Where to find more resources:
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In this episode, we cover:
0:00 - Introduction
2:20 - Back from Retirement
4:12 - Philosophy
6:38 - Evolution of design
8:02 - Problem with design industry
9:10 - HCI is wrong
12:03 - No Design CEOs
15:21 - Power, Wealth
16:40 - Artificial Intelligence
23:25 - Surprising evolution of AI
31:19 - Controversy
35:32 - What's wrong with Apple
38:38 - Virtual reality
40:30 - Technologist
42:38 - Theory vs reality
44:38 - Generalist
45:53 - People, History
48:13 - Hardest problem
51:20 - Great designers
53:38 - Conflict of past work
55:53 - Better world
1:00:29 - Educate on history
1:00:57 - Legacy, Don Norman's Prize
1:04:42 - Sustainability
1:07:43 - Ethics, Morality, Fairness
1:08:56 - 21st Century
1:12:18 - Final advice
Sponsor ADPList’s Newsletter: https://www.passionfroot.me/felix
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PS. Want more resources for senior designers & design leaders?
Julie Zhuo (ex-VP of Design, Meta): Early Facebook Days, Leaving Meta & Building Data-Informed Products. YouTube, Substack.
Jakob Nielsen: Why AI is Changing Design (forever) feat. Sarah Gibbons. YouTube.
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Thank you for reading ADPList’s Newsletter. I hope you found it valuable. Forward to a friend if you did or share on social to get others thinking.
I'll keep creating great stuff if you keep watching, listening, or reading. I read every reply if you care to reply :). You might get an answer back.
Until next week.
Felix Lee
Don Norman